hyperlinkopotamus
zorkmidden left a comment at 3:46 pm 09/02
franco cbi is also here
franco cbi is also here
zorkmidden left a comment at 3:09 pm 09/02
Cam left a comment at 2:43 pm 09/02
zorkmidden is also here
zorkmidden is also here
zorkmidden left a comment at 3:47 pm 09/02
king's shadow is also here
king's shadow is also here
zorkmidden left a comment at 1:03 pm 09/02
Aridog left a comment at 12:20 pm 09/02
packen, zorkmidden, Thousand Sons, and Cam have also commented
packen, zorkmidden, Thousand Sons, and Cam have also commented
Cam left a comment at 2:55 pm 09/02
zorkmidden, packen, and Mar have also commented
zorkmidden, packen, and Mar have also commented
Cranky Phil left a comment at 1:46 pm 09/02
Aridog is also here
Aridog is also here
zorkmidden left a comment at 11:46 am 09/02
cba at parents, packen, and Aridog have also commented
cba at parents, packen, and Aridog have also commented
zorkmidden left a comment at 2:09 pm 09/02
Aridog, Christine Keeler, and cba at parents have also commented
Aridog, Christine Keeler, and cba at parents have also commented
Cam left a comment at 10:51 am 09/02
Smit, RWC, Cranky Phil, packen, and Mar have also commented
Smit, RWC, Cranky Phil, packen, and Mar have also commented
zorkmidden left a comment at 3:35 pm 09/02
Aridog, Earl, Thousand Sons, Brooklyn Bill, Cranky Phil, Mar, packen, and RWC have also commented
Aridog, Earl, Thousand Sons, Brooklyn Bill, Cranky Phil, Mar, packen, and RWC have also commented
zorkmidden left a comment at 5:57 pm 08/31
China acquiring capability to destroy CBGs
Adam Yoshida points out a highly disturbing development. The Communist Chinese are seeking to buy the capability to destroy entire carrier battle groups, America's foremost instrument of power and force projection.
Quietly, and beneath the radar of the vast majority of Americans, the People’s Republic of China is building up its armed forces to pose a true threat to the United States. The latest sign of this danger comes in the form of reports that the Chinese are looking into acquiring up to forty TU-22 “Backfire? bombers from Russia.
If you’re a fan of Tom Clancy, or if you’re familiar with the operations of the US Navy during the later stages of the Cold War, the very name should send a shiver down your spine. The Backfire is powerful, long-range, supersonic bomber capable of carrying a number of powerful anti-ship missiles.
In the form of the TU-22, the Soviet Union devised the ultimate anti-carrier weapon. The concept was simple: these bombers would reach out into the Ocean to assault either US troop convoys or Carrier Battle Groups. The bombers would dash in at maximum speed, fire their missiles at supersonic speed, and overwhelm American defenses in a massive barrage.
These weapons were considered dangerous enough the F-14 Tomcat, the AIM-54 air-to-air missile, and the AEGIS air defense system were primarily designed to guard against them. Only through careful concentration of firepower would a US Carrier group be able to overcome a massed bomber strike of the sort that the Soviets were capable of and which the Chinese are apparently reaching for.
If the Chinese are seriously thinking about buying these bombers it’s an obvious sign that China’s entire defense posture is being oriented towards an assault on Taiwan. The TU-22 is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a top-tier ground attack aircraft. It has one primary purpose: attacking and overwhelming US Carrier Groups.
Put into operation, Chinese-run squadrons of Backfires would pose the first serious threat to American Carriers since the end of the Cold War.
Worse still, the Chinese have embarked upon a $10 Billion program of Submarine acquisition. While the exact quality and composition of the force the Chinese are seeking to create is unknown, it’s hard not to be disturbed by the obvious: the amount of money proposed would buy roughly seven Virginia-class Submarines at American prices. Just what will it buy China?
This must be put in the broader context of the broader challenge to American power being put forward by China. A recent report prepared for Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld detailed the Chinese effort to gain control of strategic “chokepoints? on the world’s waterways. Most notably, as part of this effort, the Chinese have begun work on a canal (set to be controlled by China) which will allow ships to bypass the often-hazardous Straits of Malacca.
To make things even more concerning, a holding company owned by the Chinese has managed to take de facto control of the Panama Canal.
The truly alarming thing about all of this is just how smart the Chinese have been about all of this. They aren’t going to behave like the Soviet Union and have their Premier pounding his shoe on the desk at the UN. They’re going to smile a knowing smile as they kindly step towards us with their knife in their pocket.
What’s happening is very obvious: the Chinese are working quietly, but steadily, towards the day when their power will be so overwhelming as to make any challenge prohibitive. When they move against Taiwan (and it is only a matter of when, not if) they’ll be powerful enough that American participation in the defense of Formosa will mean the sure loss of at least one Carrier and ten thousand American lives. Faced with that sort of danger, virtually any American President will concede the day.
The thing being ignored in all of that is this: the day that China conquers Taiwan with the acquiescence of the United States and Japan will be the day that China becomes the master of all Asia.
Extreme solutions are the only ones likely to solve this problem. The Chinese have moved so quickly and so stealthily that our only chance to stop them is to take a roll of the dice on any of a number of risky solutions. Either we begin an immediate anti-Chinese military build-up and commit to defend the rest of Asia in the event of aggression by China or we begin to explore less orthodox means of reprisal.
I, for one, suggest that we begin by asking ourselves if, in the case of Taiwan, “proliferation? is such a bad word after all.
Posted by evariste on Jan 30, 2005 10:59 am
recent comments
[ #9 ]/ king's shadow: LOL! Let me know what you think of the film.
LOL, it's good to see you again franco, I've missed you.
I'm watching "The Book of Eli", and the very first scene, Denzel Washington kills a cat.
That will be one of the finalists for Threadline of the Year. :)
Good to see you again, RWC. I was afraid that you had flounced after the Bacteria thread. :) And
[ Vanity Fair's Sarah Palin Profiler: 'The Worst Stuff Isn't Even In There' ]/ ' The
' The Palestinian Authority and Christian leaders on Thursday signed an accord to repair the Church of the Nativity
' Asked about Hamas on Thursday, White House Mideast envoy George Mitchell said: "We do not expect Hamas to
' Abbas and Netanyahu are far apart on issues that have eluded a solution for decades, including the borders
' To relaunch Middle East peace talks on Thursday, the Israeli and Palestinian leaders and their American mediators quietly
Holy Shit. Anyone who voted for this nitfuck deserves the government that they've gotten. I feel sorry for the
#4 zorki: I think the situation is a little different _ via a vis _ South and Central American
[ #9 ]/ zorkmidden and shop for specials for denture adhesives. [img]
[ #3 ]/ Cam: I know the Chinese do that and that there are networks who loan money to
#5 zorki: She should be tried, then, for the crime of dumbfuckery - assuming that that is is a
#2 zorki: They work it off when they arrive.
A little OT, but every time I read the stories about illegal immigrants who come to the West for jobs,
packen, if you haven't seen "Fallen", you should.
[ #8 ]/ RWC: And when you're not robbing people of their bling, you can commiserate with evariste about
' Of course, I have no way of knowing if the Tamils’ claims are genuine: post-civil war Sri Lanka
It _ was _ surprising, but I felt the movie sacrificed its own internal logic and mood for the sake
[ #4 ]/ zorkmidden #3 RWC: Happy birthday, old man. Don't join a gang
[ PA arrests two Hamas members for the terror attack ]/ . The [ JPost article ]/ does not
[ #5 ]/ king's shadow: It surprised me and I liked it.
[ #6 ]/ Thousand Sons: And they wouldn't drop out of school if only they had schools. Or alarms.
22 comments, latest by evariste at 11:07 am 1/22
I think we should also all say a big THANK YOU to Clinton for making sure the Chinese had access to all of our top defensive military technology, including critical satellite technology.
Testing. I hope no one blew up bloggie again.
Why, are you having problems?
What's this all about? Oh, well. There goes my dumb joke about CBGB's.
I quoted the title of the headline, and then threw in a link to CBGB's website, but it made bloggie ill.
hmm...bloggie is supposed to ask my permission before it can deny anyone, anything...
bloggie! come here you little monster!
"...will be the day that China becomes the master of all Asia. "
It is inevitable. There is neither the will or the capability in the US to stop the political hegemony of China in Asia. China has a surplus of young males of perhaps 200 million, each a potential recruit to the Red Army. A ~10% annual GDP growth rate. A crippling balance of trade surplus and current account surplus with any nation with which it conducts business. China is unassailable, even if its banking system collapses.
Further, America, even in her own backyard, appears to have conceded that strategic Canadian oil and steel interests may be acquired by China. I find this seeming disinterest especially puzzling.
Yeah, the first thing I thought of too was why would China want to destroy a NYC punk nightclub?
China has long wanted to project its power beyond just its borders. It has so far lacked the capaibilities to do so because of lack of technologies and/or knowhow. Acquiring the Backfires would definitely improve their ability to strike at CBGs, although it would be more useful as theater denial systems - limit where the CBGs could transit safely.
Think of the water between Taiwan and China. That's the first place that China would want to deny US and allies CBGs/task forces from operating freely. If you limit how the US can act in the waters around Taiwan, the Chinese force the US to react and change tactics to come to the assistance of the Taiwanese government. The same could be said about littoral waters. It pushes USN battle groups further out to sea in order to limit their ground assault capabilities and it changes the nature of potential plans.
Definitely not good news any way you cut it.
Yet, there is something else that we should keep in mind. The Chinese (and Soviets before them) long exaggerated their military capabilities beyond what they actually had. Now, while the US has to consider the worst case scenario - overbuilding capabilities and beefing up carrier defenses (and it wasn't just Backfires that were considered the threat, but Exocets and other sea skimmer missiles that brought about Aegis systems) - but there is a possibility that this is nothing more than bluster (see similar articles that the Chinese exaggerated their economic growth over the past decade that is unsupported by the evidence.
Let's get something straight...China does not want to harm the United States of America. They don't want any conflict, all they want is to trade and make peaceful progress. They do not want to attack Taiwan, but they will never allow independence simply because the stragetic consequences are unacceptable. Truth be told, China has a SENSIBLE REASON for reunification for it will safeguard their NATIONAL SECURITY. However the pro-independence Taiwanese only desire independence for their so called "Taiwanese" pride. It really has nothing to do with socialism vs. democracy, the PRC has long stated that they support the one country two systems policy so the whole freedom argument is shot to hell. So the real issue is not China's threats, but US interference. It is a common fact that if the US would back off the issue, there would be no more Taiwan issue. But they insist on sticking their nose where they don't belong, why? Because the US wants another ally to surround and contain China. They already have Japan, South Korea, as well as several South East Asians countries as possible military outposts. Taiwan is the final link in the chain. So if you're mainland China, and freeing Taiwan would result in becoming contained within a circle of possible enemy bases/ports/missiles, etc., would you give it up? No, not in a million years...never. Oh yeah, not to mention Taiwan is one of the US military's top customers. I believe people should do more research before they label China as the bad guy....if anything the United Sta....
There is one choke point for oil the Chinese do not control.
The Straights of Hormuz.
Earl,
It is possible China is cooking the books on growth rate.
Anonymous,
I favor the one country solution myself. China unites with Taiwan beng the superior partner.
BTW Hong Kong is slowly being strangled politicaly and to some extent economically.
China has the same problem with Taiwan that England had with the American colonies. Having tasted independence they prefer to rule themselves.
M. Simon-
Unfortunately, Iran can shut down the Straits of Hormuz with ease, and is awfully cozy with China. As for China's cooked books, I agree and I've blogged it extensively.
M. Simon, more on Hormuz: China's naval base under construction in Pakistan is to electronically eavesdrop on ship traffic in the Straits. Also, for more on Abu Musa island and the Straits, check out the third top topic in my Winds of War briefing.
M. Simon,
Some compare the China/Taiwan situation to the Britain/America situation...others would compare it with the Union/Confederacy during the American Civil War. I personally agree with the latter.
And yes, Hong Kong is now under the rule of mainland China, therefore control is slowly being transferred to China. Simple logic. What people should realize is that the majority of Hong Kong citizens SUPPORT mainland China and its economic rise. They protest for change in mainland China but they recognize more and more that China is their country. Many Hong Kong citizens travel to and from mainland China quite often and more and more people can speak Mandarin.
BTW, I know this because I live in Hong Kong :)
IMO it would be wise for the US government to support an eventual reunification, because independence would spell disaster for both sides. China will NEVER give it up, the location is WAAAY too strategic. It would be suicide for their military and oil/food supplies during any conflict. Even if they fight tomorrow and China loses, we will be back at square one and perhaps another 30-50 years down the road our children's children will be having this same discussion.
China is not the sweetness and light regime anonymous would like to claim.
They support the most evil regimes on the planet, like Sudan and Iran, and certainly don't face a threat from the US. The US is in South Korea because the Stalinist government of North Korea, with full support of the Chinese, invaded the South. The Chinese communists killed millions of their own citizens during the 1960s, and like most atheist Marxists, have little regard for human life. The old communists who still control the country will gladly kill to keep control, witness Tianmen Square.
If China ever had serious democratic reforms, I suspect they might be able to persuade Taiwan to take part in a peaceful reunification.
Ed, why are you posting on a year old thread when there is a similar post from today and it's going strong right now. Come and join in over there.
annie-this thread is linked from that thread, and I guess Ed missed responding to anonymous at the time :-0
Oh, I thought I wa son the correct thread.
Ooooops, 'specially when I went to the LGF Open Thread and linked to that thread, and said time to ignore the bitterness, because it was important.
Wait, I'm still on the old thread, aren't I.
Help!
LOL! Over here, Ed.